Reflexion about Asylum

[Delbareth]

Something disturbs me about Asylum. It is said that it's a city of "merchants, thieves, bandits, soldiers, renegades, assassins, ...". So my questions are :
- who feeds all this population? 
- which poor peasant wants to live in such a place? 

I wonder a little bit about that for a long time, but recently I spoke about Asylum to a friend and he asked me these questions.

[Kristian]

I assume that among these thugs are regular people, just living their everyday lives with jobs, kids and friends. These people would need a living too, so they'll propably be the butchers, bakers, craftsmen, brewers and so on.

[Delbareth]

Of course! But these poor people are beaten, swindled, robbed, overcharged, murdered... It's not an easy life. With time every honest people would have left this dangerous city. Even in Asylum there must be a major part of commoners (even if all of them are not honest), but the everyday life must be very difficult, more than usual!!!

[avisarr]

Could Asylum really work? Or would it tear itself apart? I think you bring up a good question.

There's no doubt that life in Asylum would be hard. It might seem that honest people would probably leave. But I think there are a few reasons why Asylum could work.

1. First of all, there ARE many normal people in Asylum... commoners, merchants, laborers, dock workers, craftsmen, brewers, etc. Just as Kristian said. You've got this HUGE population. They need to eat. They need to buy things. So, there is much work for inns, tavern, shops, craftsmen, etc. There are thousands of these people. So, not everyone in the city is a thief, a brigand or a thug. I may need to rewrite the Asylum description... right now it does make it seem a little too brutal. A city with nothing but thieves wouldn't work and that may be what the web page implies.

2. There are strength in numbers. Many people in Asylum band together into guilds, groups, organizations and the like for protection.

3. Protection rackets - many people simply pay for protection. It's little more than a protection racket, but if you pay off the right people, you don't get bullied or beaten. It's like having to pay a tax. A financial burden you just put up with. In fact, in Asylum, protection fees are almost a substitute for city taxes.

4. Who feeds these people? Well, there is a lot of farmland outside of Asylum. Many of these farmers group together to sell their food to Asylum. (Again, people grouping together for protection). Also, the Agrarian Guild operates huge communal farms in the grumman lands and transports foodstuffs in huge quantities to Asylum. Finally, Asylum sits on the coast and has hundreds of fishing ships which bring in tons of fish and shellfish every day. The river provides fresh water. (Yes, Asylum does sit on a river, despite what the map shows... I'll fix that later).

5. Many of the "normal honest" people can not leave. There are indentured servants, slaves, serfs, etc. Those types can't leave or they would be hunted down, punished or killed. There are also many commoners who can't leave simply because they lack the funds to do so. They know the city and there is work and food there. It takes courage to sling your possessions over your shoulder and head for the hills with no thought of coming back. In fact, most people in the middle ages were born, lived and died in the same place and never traveled. Travel was dangerous.


Sometimes complex systems which seem really chaotic sustain themselves because internal forces tend to balance each other out. That's sort of how I see Asylum. There is no central government to manage things. But with so many groups and people opposing each other and yet dependent on each other, things tend to balance out internally.

[Delbareth]

It's a very interesting answer, and I agree with you on each point.
Thank you a lot for these explanations :-)

[Delbareth]

Ok I'm annoying but I have still questions about Asylum.

- Who pay for infrastructures? Do some guild (merchant guild perhaps) make deals to restore bridges, roads or things like that?
- Who clean the city? I I mean, in Arena there are a lot of fight-to-death, but who bring the dead bodies to avoid a huge epidemic (it is written that nobody clearly rule this place). And after such a long time, the whole city must be scattered of such skeletons

It is just what I have on the top of my head. But each task an official government does must here be done by other people. In the other case it has big consequences on the city life and appearance (why not having numerous dead bodies and skeleton in the street?  )

[avisarr]

Delbareth,

These are not annoying questions at all. I'm always happy to discuss Khoras and this forum is here for exactly this purpose. So, hit me with questions any time.

The roads and buildings of Asylum were built by the groups that operate within the city. There are several major groups that have enormous resources both in treasure and manpower. Sometimes these groups pay to erect buildings or pave roads. This usually would be within their "territory" or city district. The struggle for control of Asylum has ebbs and flows as groups rise and fall. Sometimes, a single organization may win out over rivals and gain control over a large swath of the city only to be overthrown a couple of years later. Sometimes, during these periods, a group in a position of power will build something - either to aid in its growth or as a show of power. This is how many of the inner roads were paved and also how the street lamps come into being.

Asylum went through several growth spurts in the early years. Now, it has reached something of a critical mass and its expansion has slowed considerably. It may be that Asylum has reached its maximum size in its current form. Nowadays, many of the roads are in disrepair. Some of the buildings are almost totally wrecked. Each group tends to repair its own buildings. The Stonecutter's Guild gets hired a lot by various groups to build and maintain bridges, roads and buildings.

Any body left in the street would be stripped of all valuables within seconds as street urchins fight over every last coin and stitch of clothing. Rats, dogs and other critters would strip the flesh from the bone within a night or two. There are some places in the city where you will find bones or even whole skeletons. Bodies in Orctown are burned and the orcs are building a shrine out of the charred bones. Other places have mass graves (little more than pits). Some places (The Shields, the Citizen's Coalition) will give bodies proper burials. The wealthier citizens living in the nicer areas pay to keep the streets clear (of all kinds of trash). And, in many places, bodies are simply tossed into the river or into the sea. So, really, it depends on what part of the city you're in.

[Delbareth]

As usual your answers were particularely clear.
I think one of the most important aspect of Khoras (for me) is that it is a very coherent and well-thought world.
And when something appears strange at the first sight, I'm glad to learn that coherent and credible explanations exist.
Thank you

[Delbareth]

Hello!
As usual, more questions...

One in fact, but very disappointing... In Asylum you often speak about tunnels and caves : "There are many miles of sewer tunnels beneath the streets of Asylum...". But Asylum is on the waterside!!! It means that almost all tunnels are under the sealevel. It should be at least ONE connection (holes, cracks...) between tunnels and sea (even with a dense and impermeable soil). And it should mean that all underworld is submerged... 
Is there a reason for that?

[Spence]

It would seem to me that the city would maintain that, via magic or some other means to keep the sea water out....or it could be that they've designed it just so...so that when water comes in from the sea, it flushes the sewer system clean at high tide or something similar.

I'd be more inclined to lean towards the second response i've given...designed so high tide flushes all the crap away ;-)

[Delbareth]

Ok I haven't thought about that.
But in fact it works only for a sewer system, between the see level (low tide) and the Asylum ground. But it does'nt work for a complex of cave in which a lot of people lives. Or these complexes must be mentioned to be "not deep underground, very close to the surface".
No?

[Spence]

I see what you're getting at.  And i think i know where you can find your answer.

http://www.khoras.net/Khoras/Civil/Cities/Asylum/Hammerfall.htm

Read that first.  I have some conclusions i've drawn based soley from what's there.  I think that the dwarves have diverted water, firstly so they can build their city, and secondly so they can fuel what they're planning.  With this as an example, i figure the dwarves have built a very elaborate dam to keep the water at bay.

[avisarr]

Spence is right. The dwarves are in control of just about everything under the surface. Many of the tunnels ARE below sea level. However, the dwarves control what tunnels, chambers and sections of the system that water can get into and out of. Some doors are pressurized and sealed - similar to airlocks and submarine hatches. Some chambers can be flooded or emptied with large pumps. Some sections are always kept dry. Others are exposed to sea water. It's a fairly complex system, but this is what the dwarves excel at.

[tanis]

     I just had a thought, Asylum is basically Manhattan with Medieval technology. 

[avisarr]

Similar culture too.